Preview: New tab: Cast Stack

[Kannkor]

Thought I would share what I've been working on lately. It's a little too early for it to go into my revision history, even as 'in development'.

For obviously reasons, things may change, this is VERY early development, but progressing is moving along very quickly.

New tab: Cast Stack

I have combined the following tabs into one, new, major, massive tab.
Priority
CA
NamedCA
PowerHeal
Buffs
Non-Combat Buffs
Single Target Buffs


Yes, this new tab is going to be quite... large on some classes. It's designed to give you a LOT more freedom of how to play each class. For example, you may want to cast a group ward, then a debuff, then a single target ward, then a buff (incase you die?), then a nuke, then a heal, then... etc.

You can literally put things in any order you want.

Because you now are adding any ability you want, into a single list, it was going to be very error prone, because you could easily mistakenly add a nuke as a heal. Previously it was a little more clear, because you were on the Priority tab instead of the CA tab. To help reduce user errors here, I completely rewrote the SpellExport (named AbilityExport now), and completely rewrote the logic to determine what an ability actually is.

What that means is, Ogrebot now knows a res is a res, and not a heal, or CA etc.
Ogrebot also knows when an ability has a duration, and will give you the option to [ID] or [M] it. If it doesn't have a duration, there are no need for these options to be displayed.
* Admittly, I did laugh pretty hard at seeing abilities on the CA tab with: Kick [M] [ID] [IE] [IAE]

When you click on an ability, it will only display to you, any options that logically make sense to Ogrebot.
For example: If you click on a single target heal, you will have the option of having it act like a: Heal, PowerHeal, Combat
Only these two options, because the rest ( Res, Buff, CA, NamedCA, Cure ) - just don't make sense.
Some abilities will only have 1 option. Such as: Res, Cures. They really can't be used in any other fashion.

I have added to the UI, quite a few options to enhance this even more.
Worth noting before I continue, only the UI has been coded, it has absolutely zero functionality. It's possible some of these may not end up existing.
You can select "# of people" for any group ability.
You can select "HP%" for any "Heal" "PowerHeal".
You can combine these together. For example, say - I want to cast a group heal when 3 or more people are under 75% health each.

Unfortunately, with the combination of all these tabs, I need to change some functionality that people have come to know, and basically call it something else. This is going to end up confusing, but it had to be done. Let me explain.
CURRENTLY (this is NOT how Cast Stack will work)
CA: If you select [M] - It only ever casts that spell on 1 target at a time.
CA: If you select [ID] - It ignores the duration and recasts the spell as soon as it's available.
CA: If you don't select either, it casts the spell once per target, and doesn't refresh until it's gone.

Priority-Combat: [M] - Only ever casts that spell if it's not on the target (This was equal to CA's no options selected).
Priority-Combat: If you didn't select M, it would recast the spell as soon as it's available. (This was equal to CA's ID option).

As you can see, these options did drastically different things, depending on which tab you were on. To fix this and make it uniform, something had to change.
Here is the new plan (again, not coded yet). This will work for ANYTHING that has [M] or [ID] or no option on the Cast Stack tab.
[M] - Hmm... not sure yet... May remove it.
[ID] - Will recast as soon as it's available.
* Example1: Ward [ID] - As soon as it's off cooldown, will cast it again.
* Example2: DoT [ID] - As soon as it's off cooldown, will cast it again.

No options selected:
* Example1: Ward - Will only recast once it is not on that target.
* Example2: DoT - Will only recast once it is not on that target.

The big difference here, is if you want your wards to "spam" cast, you will need to ID them now. And if you want to not spam them, you leave them with no options.
As noted, I'm not sure Maintained is useful anymore.

Here are some random screen shots to give an example of how it may look/feel. Again, this is VERY early development, however I'm showing pictures of it now, and explaining how it works, so if anyone sees any major flaws/issues, hopefully I can find out about them now, rather than when it's done, and end up needing a major rewrite..

Short list of things that aren't immediately available/I have to look at:
Items (I'll make sure these get added in, they are too important).
Fighter avoidance buffs (Where it shows up as on you, but you cast it on someone else, "Single Target buff that appears on you" on the buff tab right now)
Chain tabs (I don't see an issue, since it's just a call to another function, but that's as development continues)
Group heals (Designating the # of people low)
BL savagery
Channeler dissonance
Max Increments

Feel free to leave feedback/suggestions/requests directly related to this.

AllOptions.JPG (41.16 KiB) Viewed 27502 times

SelectingABuff.JPG (35.78 KiB) Viewed 27502 times

Nuke.JPG (36.27 KiB) Viewed 27502 times

GroupRes.JPG (36.68 KiB) Viewed 27502 times

Groupheal.JPG (36.41 KiB) Viewed 27502 times

AENuke.JPG (35.67 KiB) Viewed 27502 times

FilledIn.JPG (51.84 KiB) Viewed 27502 times

[Kannkor]

This is mostly a list for myself of progress, things I have tested, and things I need to do yet.

Completed/Tested:
Self buffs
Group buffs

Single Target Buffs
[*] Self
[*] Own pet
[*] Group member
[*] Group member pet
[*] Raid member
[*] Raid member pet

Combat
[*] Single Target Reactive (with and without ID)
[*] Group Reactive (with and without ID)
Both tested on someone in and out of group.

Heals - Single Target Abilities
[*]@Raid -> 100% (Heals yourself...)
[*]@Group -> 100% (Heals yourself...)
[*]@Me -> 100% (Heals yourself...)
[*]MyToonName -> 100%
[*]GroupMemberName -> 100%
[*]GroupMemberPet -> 100%
[*]RaidMemberName -> 100%
[*]RaidMemberPet -> 100%

Heals - Pets
[*] Coded - not tested.

Heals - Group heals where # is > 1
[*] Tested #=2 %=99 -> Didn't heal (Correct)
[*] Tested #=2 %=100 -> Did heal (Correct)
[*] Tested #=3 (Group size 2) %=100 -> Didn't heal (Correct)
[*] If you select a single person instead of @Group, it will ignore the # of people to heal, since that doesn't make sense. You either want it to look at the group (in which case you'd use @Group), or you want it to look at a single person and ignore the #.

Curse Curse
[*] @Raid -> not tested
[*] @Group -> not tested
[*] Toonname -> not tested

Cures - In general I just used existing cure code, with a few performance tweaks. Didn't do a rewrite like the rest of it, because curing sucks to deal with.
Cures - Single target
[*] @Raid -> not tested
[*] @Group -> not tested
[*] Toonname -> not tested

Cures - Group
[*] not tested

Res - Single target
[*] Toonname
[*] @Group
[*] @Raid - not tested

Res - Group res where # > 1
[*] Works! # = 2 with only 1 dead = no res (correct)
[*] # = 2 with 2 dead = res (correct)

Res - Group res where # == 1
[*] Works

Res - Group -> @Raid
[*] Works!
Note: This will actually check where each person is dead. For example:
If you set the group res to #=3, with target of @Raid. This ability will only be used if 3 people are dead from the same group. If 2 people were dead from group1, and 2 dead from group2, this ability would be skipped, until a 3rd person died from either group. Smart smart.

Res - Group where Toonname
[*] Works identical to Single target res. Ignores # since you specified a single person

Class specific stuff like POTM/COB rotations
[*] not tested


Added the following internal Aliases.
Note: All of these specifically start with @ to designate they are an alias. Also, they all show up at the very top of the list..
Note2: 'Raid' 'GroupOnly' will NOT function on this tab. They will be treated as possible character names. Use the @ Versions instead.
@Me -> not tested yet
@Group -> Checks everyone in your group, starting with yourself. If not grouped, checks yourself.
@NotSelfGroup -> Checks everyone in your group, except for youself.
@Raid -> Checks everyone in the raid. If you are not in a raid, checks your group. If you are not grouped, checks yourself.
@NoTarget -> For items, to specify no target is required (generally speaking, self buffs)

CA
[*]DD
[*]Dot (with no options checked)
[*]Dot -> With ID
[*]Dot (with no options checked) on multiple targets
[*]Short term buff (Divine Recovery)
[*] Group Reactive (with no options)
[*] Group Reactive -> With ID
[*]Encounter nuke (with no options)
[*]Encounter nuke -> With IE
[*] PBAE nuke (with no options)
[*] PBAE Nuke -> With IAE
[*] Flanking or behind
[*] Flanking or behind requiring stealth
[*]Training dummy with 'NamedCa' (doesn't use, which is correct)
[*]Training dummy with 'NamedCa' and 'Forced Named CA' checked (Does use, which is correct).

CA -> BL support
[*] Tested advantages and primals

CA -> Channeler support
[*] Three options available
[*] No additional options. -> Cast the spell if it's available, as long as you have enough dissonance
[*] "D>" -> Only use this ability if your dissonance is Greater than or equal to _____. Example: Dissipate -> D> 6000. Will only use "Dissipate" if your dissonance is over 6000.
[*] "D<" -> Only use this ability if your dissonance is Less than or equal to ____. Example: Poison Bolt -> D< 2000. Will only use this nuke if your dissonance is less than 2000. This can be useful to get some damaging abilities in without raising your dissonance too much.

Item Support - Cure
[*] Support for only the 4 generic cure potions. can add more in as needed. Unfortunately these need to be harded.

Item support - Hostile
[*] not tested

Item support - Heal
[*] not tested

Item support - Power heal
[*] not tested

Item support - Buff
[*] not tested

MCP -> UseItem
[*] Revamped and updated for the new system.
MCP -> UseItemOnPlayer
[*] Revamped and updated for the new system.

MCP -> Cast.. / Cancel_Cast..
[*] Revamped and updated for the new system.
MCP -> CastOn.. / Cancel_CastOn..
[*] Revamped and updated for the new system.

Note: Some custom MCP buttons may need to be updated. IE: If they were set to QueueCommand instead of a direct atom call, they need to be updated. The atom call redirects to a new function now.

Added:
ChangeCastStackListBoxItem (works identical to how ChangePriorityListBoxItem did.. except it works on Caststack)

Updated the following functions to the new system (Note: Most/all of these are MCP related).
Immaculate res
Res stones
Evac
Call to Guild hall
Confront Fear
Verdict
Mezzing



Removed the following MCP commands
Warlock Myth clickie (it's automated now)
Lord djon... stuff. Since no one is ever going to go back and do that zone now a days.
Trak-HUD
Turt-HUD
DoV-Debuff
ChangePriorityListBoxItem
ChangeCAListboxitem

Removed the DoV debuff code completely from Ogrebot at this time. If it's still actually needed I can add it back in. But with the way the old content is, I'm confident people can do it without these debuffs, or manually do them. If there really is a big enough need, I'll spend the time to add them back in. (Note: The secondary reason I'm leaving them out, is they have a small performance penalty by having the code exist, even if they aren't being used).

The following no longer are required, and will not be part of this tab.
[*]Manastone (Use it as an item)
[*]Use Hearts - If people actually use these, I can add support in later
[*]Use Shards - If people actually use these, I can add support in later
[*]Jcap tab (put them in Cast Stack as Combat)
[*]Gravitas tab (put them in Cast Stack as Combat)
[*]RO (bards) (put them in Cast Stack as CA)
[*]VC (bards) (put them in the Cast Stack as CA)
[*]BLPrimals tab (put them in the Cast Stack as CA)
[*]Priority tab
[*]PowerHeal tab
[*] CA
[*]NamedCA
[*] Warlock's Dark Aggravation
To clarify more. This option is on the 'Warlock' tab. It is no longer needed there, because it works fine as a CA / NamedCA. To use Dark Aggravation, simply add it to the Cast Stack as a CA/NamedCA.
Note: Visually I have left the priority/ca/namedca tab there to view. This is to make converting to Cast Stack tab easier, so you can see your existing cast orders. The code for these tabs is never run.

New tab order is now:
[*] Zone specific code (raid/grind)
[*] Crowd Control
[*] Assist
[*] Verdict
[*] Cure Curses that were injected (NOT from Cast Stack)
[*] Dirge -> Confront fear
[*] AutoTarget When Hated
[*] Cast Stack
[*] Curable Disables
[*] Zone Specifics two (Don't think it's currently used)
Anything not listed above, is either incorporated into the Cast Stack tab, or has been completely removed.


Duration options (Ignore Duration) will now only show if the duration of the ability is longer than the recast.


If an ability is cast that the bot didn't cast (such as, a human pressing a button). If the bot can determine which ability it is, it will use that information to 'wait' for the spell to be done (IE: if you forcefully cast a long nuke, but the bot has to cure, it will cancel the nuke to cure).
However, if for some reason the bot can't determine what the ability is, it will simply sit idle until you are done casting, then resume it's normal activities.

Some oddities... I believe this exists currently, because there's really no way around it.
If you are trying to use 2 different abilities that share the same reuse timer, Ogrebot may try to cast them both.
In short this is what happens. Using 'Litany' (Encounter nuke) and 'Litany Circle' (AE nuke) as an example. These two abilities share the same timer.
I have these two abilities next to each other.
I'm fighting an encounter - The bot uses litany. As soon as it's done casting, the bot goes to find a new ability to cast. It knows it can't recast Litany yet. The bot is actually able to find a new ability some times before the server can update the client, to where it shows Litany Circle on cool down. Before this update happens, some times the bot will find Litany circle, and try to cast it. It will fail very quickly (because the reuse timer starts). Without making a list of shared timers, there really isn't a fix for this, and would have existed already. At this time, just an oddity, and no plans on finding a fix for it, as it is limited to very few abilities.

** NEED TO TEST **
Conjuror Plane shift.

** Performance changes **
Here is a list of things that technically impact the user that I have changed. Some are extremely minor and you would probably never notice unless I told you.
[*] The 'mob/priest info' update time was changed from the default (4 frames) to (12 frames). This update still happens extremely quickly, but if you really focus, you can see it is a little slower than previously. I made this change because these displays are the 5th most performance impacting call in Ogrebot. Which, is a lot...
[*] For now, I've reduce the turbo from 500 to 300. This is the amount of data that is processed in a single frame. Will monitor and see if any changes should be adjusted.

[Scoops]

Excellent changes coming, looking forward to it. A few thoughts (or maybe wishlist for the future):

* Consider moving "NamedCA" to a checkbox instead of it's own type. Then you have the flexibility to mark things other than CAs as Named only (see next item).

* For items such as reactive heals, wards, etc., would it be feasible to add an "amount remaining" to recast? For example, Inquisitor's Malevolent Diatribe can trigger somewhere between 9-22 times depending on AA/group makeup but I don't want to wait for it to completely expire before it refreshes. This could be used with the above NamedCA option to make it recast with a higher threshold on named encounters which would be incredibly handy.

* Add a new checkbox "[FE] Force Encounter Nukes", which will enforce the minimum number of targets on the Setup page. This will come in handy for spells/CAs that are AE but not marked as such (Necro Awaken Grave for instance).

* Add new checkboxes for special class AA attacks: "Max power" for Wizard Manaburn, "Max Health" for Necro Lifeburn, "Max Pet Health" for Necro Soulburn. Alternately, could specify a percent threshold to cast.

* Was going to ask for the option to "Never Interrupt" the ChainTab (since Priority tab can currently do that), but it sounds like with this all-in-one tab that should be built-in! (hopefully, as bards rejoice)

* Add internal alias: "@Othergroup", for spells such as Mana Flow.

More as I think of them.

[Scoops]

One that people have been asking for: Aggro management. One way would be threat thresholds for the cast stack:

[X] Threat level > _80_
or
[X] Threat level < _50_

Another way would be something on the setup tab similar to %NPC HP:

_80_ % Threat to use aggro abilities, then create a new list similar to the invis abilities to add/remove hate CAs

[jgarza00]

It's designed to give you a LOT more freedom of how to play each class.

The flexibility statement is wonderful so can we keep our option to use specific Abilities on Named Encounters only? A "flag/switch/checkbox/radio button/wtfever you coders call them" to specify if an Ability should ONLY be used when a Named is target/implied target?
* Example1: DeBuff of Doooooom [Named] - Will only cast on Named Encounters.

[ID] - Will recast as soon as it's available.
* Example1: Ward [ID] - As soon as it's off cooldown, will cast it again.
* Example2: DoT [ID] - As soon as it's off cooldown, will cast it again.

With the substantial increase to Potency there is a DoT that my highest DPS would gain from if it could be cast then toggled off, as its Reuse timer doesn't start ticking until it's either cancelled or expires. I realize this is a VERY specific and in your eyes pointless (Conjuror) circumstance but perhaps other subclasses might benefit from such functionality?
* Exampl1: Winds of Velious [NoTick] - Will cancel maintained after applied, teehee.

As noted, I'm not sure Maintained is useful anymore.

I'm really trying to think of an application for this but since your description of its different functionality between Priority and CA/NamedCA I think you're right.

Short list of things that aren't immediately available/I have to look at:
Items (I'll make sure these get added in, they are too important).
Fighter avoidance buffs (Where it shows up as on you, but you cast it on someone else, "Single Target buff that appears on you" on the buff tab right now)
Chain tabs (I don't see an issue, since it's just a call to another function, but that's as development continues)
Max Increments

Items - Will OgreBot know if an item needs to be equipped to use? If not, I imagine a "flag/switch/checkbox/radio button/wtfever you coders call them" would be appropriate. Of course, you probably have some infinitely superior mechanism already thought of.

Fighter avoidance buffs - I've always been a little confused about these. Some function in the "Single Target buff that appears on you" and some don't, I'd have to go back and look. I'm certain my Monk does not have Tranquil Vision in that field.

Chain tabs - Since Priority is removed will Chains be uninterruptible? Will "cancel spellcast to group cure" still interrupt a Chain?

Max Increments - I can't think of one character I've ended up keeping this switch on but I will look.

** NEED TO TEST **
Conjuror Plane shift.

Curious what this means, I currently have Plane Shift in my CA tab.

Will post more questions as I think of them. Thank you so much for your passion. Ogre is by far the most powerful collection of tools available. I can't wait to see how you make it even better!

JGarza00

[Kannkor]

It's designed to give you a LOT more freedom of how to play each class.

The flexibility statement is wonderful so can we keep our option to use specific Abilities on Named Encounters only? A "flag/switch/checkbox/radio button/wtfever you coders call them" to specify if an Ability should ONLY be used when a Named is target/implied target?
* Example1: DeBuff of Doooooom [Named] - Will only cast on Named Encounters.

Yes there is a 'NamedCA'. Which will work exact the same as the namedca tab.

[ID] - Will recast as soon as it's available.
* Example1: Ward [ID] - As soon as it's off cooldown, will cast it again.
* Example2: DoT [ID] - As soon as it's off cooldown, will cast it again.

With the substantial increase to Potency there is a DoT that my highest DPS would gain from if it could be cast then toggled off, as its Reuse timer doesn't start ticking until it's either cancelled or expires. I realize this is a VERY specific and in your eyes pointless (Conjuror) circumstance but perhaps other subclasses might benefit from such functionality?
* Exampl1: Winds of Velious [NoTick] - Will cancel maintained after applied, teehee.

We all need dreams..

As noted, I'm not sure Maintained is useful anymore.

I'm really trying to think of an application for this but since your description of its different functionality between Priority and CA/NamedCA I think you're right.

Short list of things that aren't immediately available/I have to look at:
Items (I'll make sure these get added in, they are too important).
Fighter avoidance buffs (Where it shows up as on you, but you cast it on someone else, "Single Target buff that appears on you" on the buff tab right now)
Chain tabs (I don't see an issue, since it's just a call to another function, but that's as development continues)
Max Increments

Items - Will OgreBot know if an item needs to be equipped to use? If not, I imagine a "flag/switch/checkbox/radio button/wtfever you coders call them" would be appropriate. Of course, you probably have some infinitely superior mechanism already thought of.

No, but I could probably add it.

Fighter avoidance buffs - I've always been a little confused about these. Some function in the "Single Target buff that appears on you" and some don't, I'd have to go back and look. I'm certain my Monk does not have Tranquil Vision in that field.

Previously, some of them needed their own special spot, but I believe I've changed it so it works... The guardian one works as a 'buff' in the new system anyways.

Chain tabs - Since Priority is removed will Chains be uninterruptible? Will "cancel spellcast to group cure" still interrupt a Chain?

Chains are currently removed. They may, or may not return.

Max Increments - I can't think of one character I've ended up keeping this switch on but I will look.

They are back in.

** NEED TO TEST **
Conjuror Plane shift.

Curious what this means, I currently have Plane Shift in my CA tab.

There was some special internal code for it, that I didn't move over to the new system cause I didn't think it was needed.

Will post more questions as I think of them. Thank you so much for your passion. Ogre is by far the most powerful collection of tools available. I can't wait to see how you make it even better!

JGarza00

Responses in red, cause I'm way too tired to quote shit tonight..

[Kannkor]

Performance notes:
This is using the current live build (that everyone is using right now) vs various builds of v17 (the new tab).

There is a considerable DECREASE in performance (fps loss) while out of combat. And this actually makes sense.
V16 (Current live build)
Only scans the buff tab (once every 3s) and the priority tab, while you're out of combat. It doesn't even look at the CA/Named CA.

V17 (new build)
It has to 'scan' every single ability, see what it is (buff/ca/etc), then it skips what it doesn't need. So there is more overhead while sitting idle (because it's scanning say, 100 abilities in the list, instead of 30).

I'm actually fine with a decrease in performance while out of combat.

In combat, your fps goes up considerably (because it's finding abilities to use, instead of scanning 100 abilities every frame).

I've done a few hours worth of profiling, and have tweaked and rewrote a few parts that provided additional fps gains (both in and out of combat). At this very moment, I feel the performance is acceptable. I'm going to continue to progress to get some testers going on it. Then I'm going to work on some more performance gains (there are serveral I can do, just some are a lot of work for minimal reward, so there isn't any point delaying it unless there is an absolute need at this stage).

[Kannkor]

Performance notes:
This is using the current live build (that everyone is using right now) vs various builds of v17 (the new tab).

There is a considerable DECREASE in performance (fps loss) while out of combat. And this actually makes sense.
V16 (Current live build)
Only scans the buff tab (once every 3s) and the priority tab, while you're out of combat. It doesn't even look at the CA/Named CA.

V17 (new build)
It has to 'scan' every single ability, see what it is (buff/ca/etc), then it skips what it doesn't need. So there is more overhead while sitting idle (because it's scanning say, 100 abilities in the list, instead of 30).

I'm actually fine with a decrease in performance while out of combat.

In combat, your fps goes up considerably (because it's finding abilities to use, instead of scanning 100 abilities every frame).

I've done a few hours worth of profiling, and have tweaked and rewrote a few parts that provided additional fps gains (both in and out of combat). At this very moment, I feel the performance is acceptable. I'm going to continue to progress to get some testers going on it. Then I'm going to work on some more performance gains (there are serveral I can do, just some are a lot of work for minimal reward, so there isn't any point delaying it unless there is an absolute need at this stage).

Well, after listening to primalz cry for an hour, I decided I would take the time now to do even more tweaks. Out of combat performance once again equal to live bot. In combat performance may have increased, but so minor a human probably couldn't tell without running a profiler. (In combat of v17 compared to v16 has increased period, but with these latest set of changes from v17 to newest v17, is the negligible change).

[jgarza00]

Forgot to ask; how will Cast Stack time auto-attacks? 0.0

[Kannkor]

Forgot to ask; how will Cast Stack time auto-attacks? 0.0

Doesn't.

At this moment, auto attack timing and chain tabs are temporarily removed.